Pinion oil seal

[XJSDave]

Howdy, having a slight suspicion that the oil seal on the prop shaft pinion is letting by, does anyone know the size of the nut holding the pinion to the differential and whether or not it’s a left hand thread ? The car : 1995 XJS AJ16 Coupe, I believe it’s a Salisbury diff Vin:196294. Not going to carry out this work until after the Jagfest, 15.6.19, as I want to attend this meeting.....there is experience talking

[poprivet]

If similar to mine, despite some people predicting doom I found it quite an easy job. have a read of viewtopic.php?f=42&t=9711&p=74229&hilit=seal#p74229

I can't remember the socket size but it was very tight, I remember at the time thinking it might be left hand thread but it was just tight. You need to find something suitable to seat the new seal home, baked bean tin sized but much stronger!

[XJSDave]

Hi poprivet, Thanks for the reply and yes I had read the info you suggested with the link supplied. The reason I posted my enquiry is, as you know, when tucked into a job there is usually something to trip you up, e.g. my socket set may be to sturdy to to fit into the confined space that you have pointed out to locate on the nut. Good to know its a right hand thread, saves a little apprehension so thanks for that. I recently replaced the front discs/pads/callipers but snapped off a bolt head which held the offside calliper in place. Being brief, to fix this I had to destroy the o/s calliper by cutting it out and then drilling out the thread and collapsing it in the stub axle bracket. The remaining broken bolt in the steering arm was remedied by a second hand arm and bolt supplied by Andy Harvey of justxjsltd for just £30.00. I'm booked in for the pride and joy section at Jagfest in Kent next week , N400 so don't want to miss this complements of sod's law. Would add some pics of the brake issue but don't know how. Regards Dave

[XJSDave]

Hi All, Pinion oil seal, I knew there would be trouble but not expected from Guy Salmon, Aylesford Kent. My seal was letting by but only slightly to give the annoying smell, never looked wet. I decided to let Guy Salmon carry out the work as this needed to be done correctly as stated in the forum. After GS had replaced the seal, 500 miles later the smell returned and on inspection the oil drip on the bottom of the seal/casing had returned. At this point also noticing the 2mm clean section of shaft from the gator on the prop indicating that the pinion nut must have been over tightened to pull the pinion nearer the differential. Waiting 2 weeks for a slot, GS took the car back in, 1995 4.0ltr xjs, and replaced the seal and within twenty miles again the oil drip has reappeared. The leak seems to be around the perimeter of the seal and not on the shaft. GS said they had changed the seal and that was the cause. While inspecting the leak I now noticed the clean prop shaft issue by the gator had increased to 5mm along with a couple of nuts on the prop shaft/pinion being slightly rounded by a slack spanner. I will obviously take this up with GS tomorrow, (23.9.19) but I'm now wondering if they have overtightened the pinion nut would this require a diff strip down? All comments gratefully received.

[davidr]

There is a collapsible spacer inside and that is crushed by doing up the pinion nut. It's purpose is to set the gears in the diff to the right relationship so they mesh correctly.
If the nut has been over tightened then the spacer will have been crushed further and the pinion and crown wheel pulled together. Have you noticed any more noise from the diff?

[XJSDave]

Hi David, Thanks for the reply and apologies for the delay in getting back. Seems to be a slight noise but could not specifically put this down to the diff. I don't want to take any chances with possible further damage by using the car and have now found an excellent restoration company, ASM Classics, opposite Brands Hatch, who will drop the rear subframe, remove and recondition the diff and replace. This is a company with guys who really know there business mainly restoring E types to pristine condition and indeed just having sold one £200k. I have also spoken to the chap who re-builds the diffs, a job he has been doing for 50 years and having detailed conversations with these mechanics I now feel very reassured that my car is with competent people and in the right place. Double chuffed at my article being published in October addition of our mag, I can also use this to further my issue with Guy Salomon, Aylesford regarding a refund for the shoddy and unsuccessful work carried out.
I will keep you posted on the events that will open up this coming week,

Kind Regards, David Allen.

[ptjs1]

David,

Well done on your article in the October magazine. The car looks great and, like mine, is one of the unusual AJ16 cars with body-coloured mirrors and headlight surrounds that were made for a year before the Celebration models. Do you know where it was for the period before its first registration? (I noticed it's on an N-reg, although it was built before April 95.)

It's really disappointing that you've not had a good service from Guy Salmon. I know the guys there very well and apart from using them for parts (with generous discount) I still trust them with my aircon as a couple of the long-term technicians are very good on XJS. In fact, I'm popping down there today to book an appointment as I'm just about to put a new Sanden compressor in my car (also from SNG). It's a real shame that they didn't sort your diff seal properly. Do let me know if I can help in any discussions with the Service Manager who knows me well.

I'm pleased to hear that you've found someone local who seems to understand Jaguar rear-end cages. I think I'll pop up and see them sometime (I live in West Malling)! When I had some diff noises some years ago, it proved not to be the output bearings (which can be done in situ) but the main bearing. Keith Parrington at XJ Restorations rebuilt the rear end and Bexhill gearboxes rebuilt my diff. It's been quiet ever since.

Do let us all know how you get on, David.

Cheers

Paul

[XJSDave]

Hi Paul, Thanks for the offer of help with the people at Guy Salmon. I sent them a detailed account of events by email which they said they would get back to me, which they have not done yet (1 week), possibly because I requested a refund for the work undertaken, £300 ish. Its not a question of the fee, more on how I would expect a company like GS to respond to customer dissatisfaction. I don't trust the work carried out especially after the conversation with the service manager, MF when reporting that the leak was still there the second time, not on the shaft but the perimeter of the seal; after he had a consultation with the mechanic concerned, MF told me that "there was damage inside the diff casing where the seal sits and this is why its leaking around the outside of the seal". This is not where the original, very slight, leak was before.

I had booked the car in for a third time but then cancelled and due to closer inspection the nuts had been rounded off on the companion flange to prop shaft bolts and this all started to feel like some back street garage and attitude that I would not expect from GS, "not me gov, not our fault" For my own piece of mind I have now had the diff rebuilt and have asked for an inspection of the seal seating, if it is damaged this could of been caused by removal of the old seal and so proves nothing but if there is no discernible scores present then this will strongly influence my next article in our mag. As we all know, when you strip down cars of this age, collateral damage will be found ergo, rubber mounts, a new exhaust system now has to be fitted, stainless of course so you can take a guess at the expense of the overall work to be carried out, £300 is small beer in comparison.

[XJSDave]

Hi Paul, Got carried away there a bit and missed answering you questions about my XJS, I bought the car back in March from Studio cars of Preston and the date of first registration was 1.8.95. I remember back in those days buyers would wait until 1st Aug or 1st Jan to register their pride and joy so as to have the latest registration suffix, much the way dealers push this today to increase sales. We will have to meet up sometime as I'm just down the road from you, Cuxton. I should get my car back by this Wednesday, the company doing the work are first class and in fact their main business is total restorations, currently they have a couple of e-types in pristine condition. Regards Dave

[ng4xjs]

I can vouch for the fact that over tightening the pinion oil seal is not a good idea. A few years ago I entrusted my car to a local garage near Maidstone who did just that. I ended up having to have the diff rebuilt by an Eastbourne specialist. Wasn't cheap and especially when considered against the price of the original oil seal. They did do a superb job though, some ten years ago now and still working well.

I would also like to endorse Paul's comments. I have been a regular customer of GS Aylesford for over 20 years and also know the guys down there. They are a great bunch and go out of their way to provide a good service. I've always found their price on parts to be extremely competitive.

Nick

[XJSDave]

Hi Nick, Thanks for your reply, I also have used GS in the past for various issues with previous jags that I didn't fancy tackling myself, also purchasing many expensive replacement parts, wheels, rads etc which has all now come to an end. As mentioned before, I suspected that the pinion setting had been disregarded at the change of the oil seal and could not drive the car thinking of the damage this would cause over a period of time to the bearings/crown wheel. Complaining to Guy Salmon that the seal was leaking for the second time after their so called 2nd replacement seal had been fitted, a discussion by the work shop manager with the mechanic concerned I was told that there was damage/scoring of the inner surface of the differential housing noticed at the original fitting which they tried to repair and this is why the seal leaked around the outer surface of the seal. I was not made aware of this at the time. To cut a long story short, I had the diff removed and rebuilt by a specialist for my own piece of mind, and guess what, no damaged to be found with the casing but the seal had been fitted incorrectly, not square but crooked in the seating of the diff casing. Emails between myself and GS resulted with them offering a £750 goodwill payment which I accepted. Having the work now completed at a cost of approx £2k, the car now useable and for all future spares requirements its SNG or British car parts. In our club's latest addition mag there is a letter of the week outlining who can you trust with your pride and joy, to my mind word of mouth goes a long way, Differential rebuilds try : AJS Engineering 07831 163158. This guy Alan is semi retired and has been reconditioning these units for 50 years. Removing and replacing the diff was carried out by a restoration company, asm.classics@aol.com (opposite Brands Hatch) who's main business is the complete strip down and rebuild of mainly E-types jags and Ford classics, I've seen them and they are superb, very happy with this company.
Regards XJS Dave

[ptjs1]

Dave,

Thanks for letting us know of how the situation got resolved. I must take a drive down and see ASM Classics when I get a chance.

My convertible is due to have its MoT on Monday if it doesn't rain here. Fingers crossed.

Cheers

Paul

[XJSDave]

Hi Paul, No worries, I would add that ASM Classics don't advertise as they have no need to and are usually busy, still give them a try 01474 150380. A mechanic there named Joff sorted my car and is a trustworthy guy. Weather forecast is bad Monday morning. Regards Dave