Cooling with electric fans

[gungehead]

Hi,
I am new to Jaguars and the Mk2.

I have just acquired one (3. and it has an electric fan fitted as well as the engine driven fan.
I has a reasonably new (or re cored) radiator and the temp gauge sits at just above 70c. and does not move.

I have read all sorts of information/gossip/rumour about xk engines over heating but also read that there is no inherent issue with cooling.

My question is - can I remove the engine driven fan? If the kenlow is up to the job, there is no need for the original fan. The Kenlow is thermostatically controlled. Or will I be causing trouble?

Thanks in advance for your comments and advice.

Dave

[ManxNeil]

Hi, Dave, welcome to Jags and the Mark 2!

Is there any particular reason you want to remove the engine fan? During its restoration, I fitted an auxillary electric fan (manually operated, rather than thermostatically-controlled, but I think I'm in the minority there) to supplement my Mk2's cooling. Though I don't use it very often, it is reassuring to have when stuck in heavy traffic.

There will be those who know much more than me on the subject, but I'd be concerned at the drain an electric fan may make on the system were it to be the only source of cooling, and the potential for an electrical glitch to make the car undrivable.

It's an interesting question, though, and I'd also be interested to hear what others think.

Best wishes,

[lowebird]

Dave,
For what it's worth, my E-Type runs at around 75-80 degrees and seems quite happy. I have a Kenlowe fan which is themo controlled with a manual over ride if required. When the fan was fitted, the restorers removed the original electric fan without any perceived problems so I guess you might try it and see.

Reg

[piman]

Hello all,

personally I don't see the point of having two fans, either remove the mechanical and fit an electrical one of the correct size or just use the mechanical fan.

I just have an electric fan on my Triumph and it rarely cuts in, but I live in a rural area and do very little town driving. That's what I intend to do with my MK 2 when the time comes.

Alec

[gungehead]

Hi Alec,
No neither do I, hence the post. But I wanted to make sure there are no known issues such as the electrics cannot handle a fan running at tick over, or electric fans are not up to the job.
Given the size of the battery and the work it has to do to start the engine, I cannot imagine that the fan would drain the battery very quickly.

Dave

[Martec]

As I've said in other posts, the MkII with its nice lines does not encourage air into the grill and through the radiator. From my research when building our car and talks with Ken Jenkins on the subject the advice was to keep the engine driven fan as air can stall at the radiator at 70mph. He also regards an electric fan as a hindrance to air flow.

I asked my local radiator guy to recore the original radiator with a four row rather than the original 3 row core with the more modern design of core (copper). The original steel fan is apparently surprisingly efficient, but I also fitted a very large electric fan, originally auto start stop, but after several flattened batterys it is now only manual switching and in practice is not used.

In all fairness A new member of the club has just bought a 3.4 MkII (very nice) and it only has a electric fan, he said he drove it up north on a very hot day without any trouble!

In reality concentrating on one item of the cooling system is misleading. The whole system needs to be considered.

Is the radiator clean and so working efficiently?

Has it been kept at 33 to 45% blue anti-freeze and changed every 2 years (the anti corrosion package is knackered after 2 years)?

Have you got a thermostat in the system (a friend found he hadn't?), is it the right one (there are 3 types)?

Have you got the correct radiator pressure cap (my friend put a new shiny incorrect cap on and blew water out every time he stopped.

Is your pump working well or is it corroded away?

Is your ignition timing correct, this can raise the jacket temperature?

With all the above correct you don't have a problem.

All these questions have been clarified elsewhere on this forum.

Best wishes

Brian

[ecosselynx]

Hi

As I've posted before on here, I run the original fan and also have a Kenlowe installed which is thermostatically controlled. Under normal driving the original system works fine, but make sure to address all the valid points in Brian's post. Only time I hear the kenlowe switch on is when stuck in traffic in hot weather.

I'd say suggest that as you already have both fitted to just keep them.

[peterdpps]

I have had my mech fan replaced with an electric one when AC was fitted by Clayton Classics and only switch it on occasionally. Gauge sits at 70ish although it went a bit higher last week when ambient temp was higher.
Regarding the radiator cap, for my 240 it is quoted as 4lb but I had a 7lb on which disintegrated recently.

I've now fitted a new 4lb and will see if anything untoward happens. What size does everyone else recommend?

Regards
Pete

[Martec]

Its not so much the pressure as the LENGTH of the pressure cap, some early cars may still have their original top and bottom tanks, and the early top tank took a longer than normal pressure cap, only available in 4psi.

My friend had an early 2.4 and the radiator had an untidy looking long cap, he replaced it with a shiny new short cap which naturally didn't seal and so blew the water out every time he stopped. grotty cap fitted, end of problem.

I assume the later cars had the normal short cap?? I suggest you fit the cap recommended for your car assuming it still has its original top tank (the top and bottom tanks are usually kept and the new core fitted to them). look in your manual.

Brian

[peterdpps]

My car is a later model 1967 240 and has a short cap. Barratts part list quotes 4lb but there is nothing in the workshop manual. I'm running on a new 4lb at present with no apparent problems.

Pete

[Martec]

Sounds good Pete,

More pressure is not necessarily better, I often wonder if items fitted were only because they were current at the time, Lyons didn't like spending money for no good reason!

Brian

[peterdpps]

Thanks Brian. Fingers crossed I have no problems.

[Martec]

Old age is a terible thing and is affecting my memory, I forgot to ask about the Clayton AC system, I have spoken to them a few times at the NEC and it is rubbished by Watjag who fit a very fancy system. I did wonder about building my own from scrapyard bits as it is basically a very simple system.

What is your assessment of the Clayton system compared to a basic modern car system and would you have it done again given the choice?

Brian

[peterdpps]

Hi Brian,
The Clayton system that I have is one of their earlier ones and works alongside the existing heating system. They also do a full system which replaces the old heater system with a complete climate control system.

I have been very pleased with the system which is very simple with a temp control, three speed motor and two vents in the centre console. Obviously there are limitations compared to a modern system, not least the limited vents for air movement. At the time I had it cost was a factor so I went for the simple system. There is no doubt that it copes well with eVn very high temperatures and makes the car much more comfortable.

Given the cost benefits I would do it again and have no problem with Claytons. I recently had them supply a refurbished and upgraded heater box which has a more powerful motor and replacement matrix to stop the Mk2 tendency to steam up. From memory it is about £300 cheaper than the Watjag system so I guess the AC would be similar.

As an aside, I never trust any company that rubbishes their competition. It's bad business practice!

Cheers
Pete

[Martec]

Thank you Pete,

I have to admit to being a serial modifier, I have looked at this idea on and off for a few years now (SC group showed a set up to fit alternator, PS pump and AC pump). We have put up with the heat as you do on some of our summer rallies, but we are getting older and less able to cope so is becoming more of a contender.

My problem is where to put the pump and how to drive it, I have already fitted an extra pulley to drive the power steering pump and that side of the engine space is full of large alternator and PS pump. The dizzy side looks even more crowded, once I have the 'S' type back in one piece I may well look at this afresh.

Thanks again for your assessment, and yes I don't think much of it as a business practice, Claytons were always willing to talk.

Brian