New member with an incoming V12

[xtriple]

Hello all, just joined here as I am getting a 1986 V12 XJ-S, probably tomorrow! It seems to be a good car, very low mileage, factory black, stainless exhaust and the last owners have had the car for 21 years. Lots of history with her. Not chosen a name as yet so suggestions welcome. I had quite a few of these cars back in the day including a brand new 'Sportspac' 3.6 that was utterly terrible! Also had a pre-H.E. in white and a red V12 H.E. Problem is: I seem to have forgotten loads of details about them!

So a question if I may? What year did they gain ABS?

sj

[davidr]

Hello and welcome! Looks like a lovely car!
Off the top of my head ABS came around 1987/88 but I'm sure someone with a better memory will set me straight soon!

[xtriple]

Today is collection day. Scared and excited in equal measures... maybe a bit more scared! Money is in the owners bank, insurance is sorted (£118 fully comp - One Call) and I have zero space to put it in the garage!

Wish me luck.

[BigCatXJS]

Good Luck!

Whatever is in your garage now will need to make way for your XJ-S (unless its a more valuable appreciating classic car).

If she must live outside consider a good quality wax for the chrome and paintwork, an outdoor breathable car cover, and a ctec battery charger. The cover wont keep all the moisture out but should help protect against cats, dust, bird poo, hail stones, and heavy snow/rain ingress into the car interior! Some unibond dehumidifying tablets would also help.

Rich

[xtriple]

It will be in the garage as soon as I can evict the horrible Jeep thing that is currently taking up space. Not leaving it outside for long!

Having driven it a bit today, I think I need a new thermostat as it doesn't get warm and the rad caps seem to be the original 33 year old jobs! I think the overflow is allowing a bit of water to escape as well. Recommendations for parts suppliers?

[davidr]

Hi - coming back to your earlier question about ABS I've now had a chance to look it up and the Teves ABS system was introduced in March 1988 at VIN 147269.
As for your cooling system please take great care. The one golden rule of the V12 is "DON'T COOK IT!!!". The potential consequences of overheating are not good and can include warped heads or block, dropped valve seats and all sorts of scary things. Sorry to be such a doom-monger but the cooling systems of these cars need to be spot on.
It's possible that a previous owner has removed the thermostats in an ill-advised attempt to help a marginal system. I would advise a thorough check as you want to be absolutely sure that your cooling system is good. If you are going to change the thermostats I'd say go one step further and take the radiator out to back flush it thoroughly. You do need to take it out to do this - doing it in situ won't be very effective. Also flush the engine and check that your header tank has not corroded.
There is a an atmospheric catchment tank in the nearside wing and the tube to that may be blocked.
It would be best to make sure you understand how the cooling system works on the V12 as it's not conventional.
There is also a specific refilling method that you will need to follow to make sure that you get all the air out of the system. Come back to us here when you're ready and we'll help you through it.
As for suppliers, there are several that advertise in our magazine such as David Manners and SNG Barratt. Both have useful websites and can supply genuine, OE or aftermarket. Its also worth looking at Jaguar Classic Parts (Jaguar's own site) for part numbers and the original factory exploded diagrams.
Sorry again for the prophecy of doom but don't sweat - we can help!

[xtriple]

Don't panic? After that post, I am in a dizzy fit! I have ordered a new thermostat from David Manners and also a pressure switch for the oil pressure gauge, mine is leaking oil and definitely is u.s. I don't know how long they usually take to deliver but I expect soon(ish) and will then need a step by step, blow by blow account of how to change the thermostat, how to refill the system and how to bleed it! Also, anyone well in with the 'Big Man' upstairs that would like to offer up a prayer or two, I wouldn't say 'No!' Not even that sure where the thermostat is!

Thanks for all the help David

[davidr]

There are 2 thermostats - one for each bank.
When you put them in make sure that the giggle pins are in the 12 o'clock position - this makes sure that the air can escape.

And don't panic! I'm talking about prudent preventative maintenance and if your car isn't overheating then nothing to worry about. Making sure that your cooling system is in good condition gives you further peace of mind.

[davidr]

There are 2 thermostats at the front of each water rail running along the outside of each cylinder head.
On this image you can see the black cross rail running across the front of the engine. Where they are connected by the blue hoses they are the thermostat housings. 3 bolts on each I think

The thermostats look like this. Make sure they do have the giggle pins. Do not fit ones without or air will be trapped behind them and you will not be able to fill the system fully. As I said, fit the thermostats with giggle pins at the highest point.

It may be best to order a couple of gaskets as well. They are different for each side. Part numbers EBC8330 and EBC8331 I think will apply to your car but there are variants so best to speak to the guys from David Manners and check. If you have your VIN and engine number to hand that will give them what they need. Also check that you have ordered the right temperature thermostats. They come in 82 degrees and 89 degrees. Yours are most probably 89.
Hope that helps

[xtriple]

Wow, thanks for that! I have been back on to David Manners spares and ordered another thermostat, the gaskets etc and changed the entire order to OEM stuff. The cost was another £22 so not the end of the world though that did include a decent discount from them as they didn't actually have the non-OEM stuff anyway!

Worryingly, I have texted the previous owner and asked if the thermostats were removed for any reason or if they are still in there but old and decrepit (like me!) and received no reply after two texts. I do worry about buying secondhand cars (but then, a 'new' XJ-S would be a novelty... and expensive) as even when owners have had the car for decades (as in this case) you don't know when apathy set in as the car gets used so little, is it worth getting everything 'correct'?

The parts should be here in the next day or so, then the real problems start!

[davidr]

I was wondering why you thought the car wasn't getting up to temperature? Was it because the gauge was reading low or you couldn't get much out of the heater? Could be as simple as the sender unit not working properly?
Assuming you have the original barrel type temperature gauge, the needle should sit just at the bottom of the N. Any more and it's too hot.

[xtriple]

The temperature gauge sits right at the bottom, just off the bottom stop. Very occasionally it gets a fraction hotter and the idle slows down to a more suitable level. I think it's running in cold mode constantly which really can't be good for it!

[davidr]

Have you tried topping the system up? Is it full do you think?

PS. Top it up with 50:50 old fashioned green/blue antifreeze and water. The whole system takes about 21 litres from empty so 10 litres of antifreeze for a complete change. You will need some antifreeze anyway as you will have to drain some off before removing the thermostat housings. If you're lucky your car will be one of those with a drain on the side of the radiator. Otherwise you'll have to either pull a bottom hose off (messy!!) or suck it out via the header tank.

[xtriple]

David Manners, most impressive. Firstly, they were brilliant at sorting out the slight mistakes I made in the order, need two thermostats, not one, also need gaskets and also need everything OEM. Sorted without fuss or bother. Secondly, the whole lot arrived today and is all correct and the thermostats even have the 'giggle pin' (Jiggle, I know but giggle sounds like more fun!). One gasket is three holes and triangular, the other has four and is square. I presume this is correct?

Absolutely horrible day here today (wind blowing at about V12 second gear speed) and rain coming down sideways. I may well love this car already but I am not going out there messing about with cars when the bonnet is likely to land on my head at any moment!

I have a Mercedes CLK 320 convertible as well, the XJ is a world apart even though it's 20 odd years older, the ride is so much better and when I take the dogs to the park, the road is absolutely evil with more potholes per square inch than I have wrinkles! The XJ just rides along over them without a clunk or rattle whereas the MB feels like it's going to shake itself to bits even at walking pace.

I really want to use the Jaguar, but until it at least has a chance of reaching the correct temperature, I'll let it sleep. Running that rich cannot have done the car any good at all.

[davidr]

Parts arrived - good news! Well done DMG
Weather - bad news!
As for gaskets the left hand thermostat is 3 bolts and the right 4 bolts so what you gave is probably right.
Let us know how you get on when the weather improves!